Microsoft acquires Xamarin - will outsystems mobile go 100% native?

Microsoft acquires Xamarin - will outsystems mobile go 100% native?

  
http://techcrunch.com/2016/02/24/microsoft-is-buying-mobile-cross-platform-development-company-xamarin/

Outsystems could use xamarin and build a 100% native mobile app, this would be the perfect solution. If outsystems is going to wrap yet another web mobile app in a native shell - IT IS DOING IT WRONG! Throw away the current mobile web solution and start again! This time do it right and GO NATIVE! 

Mobile web app, or hyrid mobile web app is only good for businesses that does not have the resources to build a proper native mobile app! 
 
Robert Chanphakeo wrote:
"If outsystems is going to wrap yet another web mobile app in a native shell - IT IS DOING IT WRONG! Throw away the current mobile web solution and start again! This time do it right and GO NATIVE!"

I completely agree. In a March 2015 Gartner report: "Magic Quadrant for Enterprise Application Platform as a Service, Worldwide", one of the strengths listed for OutSystems read: "Applications built using OutSystems are very portable. Applications can be exported to an Eclipse or Visual Studio project...". Was this export path abandoned in the last year?

Are there any other options, outside of using the OutSystems Now shell, to aid developers who need to prepare an OutSystems project for app store (Apple and Google) submission? I've tried to get answers here with no luck:
http://www.outsystems.com/forums/discussion/17611/checklist-for-app-submission-to-play-store/

Anthony, with a paid subscription licence, you could export code to visual studio or eclipse, just contact outsystems to do this, (but you probably wouldn't want to do this anyways, its better to keep on using outsystems platform)
Robert, is there documentation covering this?

The object of exporting the OutSystems project code would be to package the binary files for submitting to the app stores. I would still want to rely on the OutSystems platform for project updates, future versions, analytics, reporting, etc.
Anthony, the mobile app, is currently a hybrid mobile app, (mobile web app wrapped in a native shell (Cordova)) , the full source code is available via github, https://github.com/OutSystems/
I'm not interested in their native shell. Exporting the project to VS or Eclipse should allow me to build a proper iOS/Android binary. There is no documentaion on this export capability?
you can not export a 100% native mobile app that is because outsystems platform does not generate a native mobile app under the hood, instead outsystems generates a mobile Web app! (however it shouldnt be doing this any more, most companies that did this in the past went from mobile web app to native mobile app Facebook is one, they said they made a big mistake by building a hybrid mobile app! Facebook is one of the most used mobile app in the world, other companies have also made this same mistake and moved to native mobile app!) anyone need prove? or real world example why mobile Web app or hybrid mobile app sucks? don't do it! - mobile web app is cool but its something to look into in the future, its just not ready right now!

BTW: I love outsystems, but generating a mobile web app is a mistake! I mentioend this to outsystems while beta testing. But outsystems already invested too much into mobile web app and went ahead with this mistake! :( I still suggest using outsystems mobile, and outsystems now! because building a 100% native app is a very time consuming and costly process - without outsystems! you just have to wait for outsystems to fix their mistake and start generating a 100% native mobile app!

EDIT: Xamarin was not mature enough when outsystems invested in mobile - mobile web and hybrid app! Generating Java for android, swift/objective-c for iOS and c# for windows, would work but it wouldn't be feasible for outsystems ! Outsystems knows web technologies, and went with the mobile web/hybrid route, it went with the route it knew best! Its a mistake but it was what made sense at the time! With the recent $55 million funding round with North Bridge Growth Equity, it would be a good time for outsystems to fix their current mistake and finally make the right move with mobile! generate 100% native mobile is the way to go! its the way of the future moving forward!
Hi Anthony,

Like Robert said the applications are Hibrid Web Applications, they are not IOS/Android apps. The source is a server side application, not something that can be built into a fully native mobile application.

The capability to get the source code of the applications is possible but it is not meant to be used to keep developing on it. It's as a No Lock-in option if you ever decide to stop being a customer.


I'm not going to comment on the thread topic. I guess you will need to wait and see what will come next.


Regards,
João Rosado
My original reply to this thread included the following:

In a March 2015 Gartner report: "Magic Quadrant for Enterprise Application Platform as a Service, Worldwide", one of the strengths listed for OutSystems read: "Applications built using OutSystems are very portable. Applications can be exported to an Eclipse or Visual Studio project...".

From my chair, the point of exporting a project to VS or Eclipse would be to use those platforms to package the project into their respective binary files. I would imagine the workflow looking something like this:

  1. Develop the app on OutSystems
  2. Export to VS and Eclipse
  3. Build the binary files
  4. Submit to the app stores
Any additional work that might need to be done on the app in OutSystems later on would facilitate this whole process over again, but that is 100 times better than submitting an empty native shell, and then calling a web app from within it.

I could repeatedly export a project to VS or Eclipse and still be a customer, correct?

Is there any documentation on this export option?
Sometimes companies have to make mistakes to realise its mistake in order to get on the right path! (This is one mistake!)


Thanks Robert.
Hi,

I read a lot of talk about mistakes but not what that mistake should be.

We have in the past created a hybrid webapp (together with OS and were probably the first ones) and delivered it to the stores. My experience on the whole was possitive. The major advantage was that changes made in the webapp part were immidiately available to the customer, no uploads and waiting in the stores needed!

The disadvantage was the native codebase: you need to keep this current with the Opertating System versions you support (ios, android) and besides that: the Android field is a bit of a mess because it runs on almost every possible tablet variation; which caused customers sometimes to complain because the app didn't work on their cheap china bougth tablet. 

Because native development needs focus the company decided to abandon active support and highly invested in a solid responsive website that would work on desktop and mobile together. Last time I checked the hyrbid app still worked, so I guess (and expected) that the responsive webapp was not everything they expected it to be :)

So, hybrid apps a mistake? I don't see it. Native apps better? absolutel! but doing it outside OS will give you a whole new set of problems. The ideal would be native (mobile) apps created by OS (something I proposed years ago https://www.outsystems.com/ideas/Idea_View.aspx?IdeaId=509). 

If this will ever be the case we will wait and see what next steps OS will take, it would be a kind of revolution I guess..

regards
Hans
I am unable to response to this thread, or continue to discuss this topic any further.
Robert,

You could've just not responded, instead of making it clear you now have information others haven't ;).
Xamarin for Everyone

"Visual Studio now includes Xamarin
As of today, we are including Xamarin in Visual Studio at no extra cost.

Xamarin will be in every edition of Visual Studio, including the widely-available Visual Studio Community Edition, which is free for individual developers, open source projects, academic research, education, and small professional teams. Develop and publish native apps for iOS and Android with C# or F# from directly within Visual Studio with no limits on app size.
 
For developers on the Mac, Xamarin Studio is now available as a benefit of your Visual Studio Professional or Enterprise subscription. Developers can use the newly-created Xamarin Studio Community Edition for free.
 
To begin developing iOS and Android apps with the full power of Xamarin and C#, download Xamarin Studio or Xamarin for Visual Studio today."

https://blog.xamarin.com/xamarin-for-all/

Well based on the live stream of NextStep 2016 that I saw today... This thread was headed in the right direction.
Luis Camarena wrote:
Well based on the live stream of NextStep 2016 that I saw today... This thread was headed in the right direction.
 Now, you've figured out why I was unable to response to this thread earlier :)
 
Outsystems is heading in the right direction now! :)

What outsytems is doing is good enough for enterprise!

Definitely looking forward to trying out the new features. Robert, Keep me posted on your experience with the new changes.
:uis

Outsystems did a good job in v10, I would use it!
 
There are two problems with a mobile web app, firstly it is slow and the UI/UX does not have a native feel, but outsystems solve this problem with retactjs - performance is really fast now! You can now build both your web app and your mobile app all in outsystem! that's all you need for a high performance/high quality product.

Wow! Now we're talking!

Any chance of access to the EAP on the 18th?
Anthony Williamson wrote:
Wow! Now we're talking!

Any chance of access to the EAP on the 18th?
 
 At NextStep they showed the link to apply. I don't know if they want to share it with who didn't attend, but asking doesn't hurt.
When you Google "early access outsystems" you'll find the following page "Join the OutSystems Platform 10 - Early Access Program". I don't see why this couldn't be shared.
The more participants, the more feedback...then the real challenge begins. What ideas, recommendations to consider?